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After 7h, my new CX2510 HST CAB developed an electrical failure. Dealer found that a wiring harness between cab and tractor was installed incorrectly, it was pinched and eventually shorted melting some wires. Harness cannot be spliced with new wires and needs entire new harness. Now 4 weeks sitting in dealer's shop and dealer still has not received an ETA for the wire harness part. I bought a Kioti instead of a Kubota because I expected excellent service but the dealer cannot even get an expected shipping date after 4 weeks!! These tractors are in production, so there must be wire harnesses available. Kioti USA telephone customer service said it will take very long time as the parts come on a ship from S. Korea. This can be shipped DHL in a small box !!!
 

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We read some type of parts supply problem virtually every day on this forum. Guys, when you buy an Asian-built or even an Eastern European tractor, you assume this risk of not being able to obtain parts in a timely fashion.

Another problem is getting parts for old tractors, where the manufacturer no longer makes these parts. From a practical standpoint, they cannot continue to make parts forever and remain competitive. In Japan for example, manufacturers stop making parts for older tractors 20 years after the final year of production.
 

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I work for an equipment manufacturer. More than half of my work these days is dealing with supply chain issues.
I wouldn't blame Kioti. You could have easily run into the same problem from any manufacturer.

Often parts and manufacturing uses different supply chains.

The tractors showing up were quite likely "in process" long before your dealer requested the harness.

About all you could do would be to try to get a buy-back and get another machine. I doubt your local lemon law will cover you tractor, but that might be worth looking into too.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I appreciate the world supply chain has gotten complex and precarious BUT Kioti is making these tractors now and shipping them. They may not have 'spare' parts but they certainly have all the parts assigned for each new tractor they are pushing out. This was an assembly error, multiwire harness not positioned in an eyelet/grommet hole correctly before the Cab was set into place. There apparently is little clearance for a field repair to fit the grommet hole. [grommet probably not correct term as its a metal hole]. If I see my dealer selling a new CX2510 HST CAB - without swapping out the bad harness first for me, I am going to be one very unhappy camper....... New York state has implemented a Farm Equipment Lemon law... but I do not like litigation
 

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I appreciate the world supply chain has gotten complex and precarious BUT Kioti is making these tractors now and shipping them. They may not have 'spare' parts but they certainly have all the parts assigned for each new tractor they are pushing out. This was an assembly error, multiwire harness not positioned in an eyelet/grommet hole correctly before the Cab was set into place. There apparently is little clearance for a field repair to fit the grommet hole. [grommet probably not correct term as its a metal hole]. If I see my dealer selling a new CX2510 HST CAB - without swapping out the bad harness first for me, I am going to be one very unhappy camper....... New York state has implemented a Farm Equipment Lemon law... but I do not like litigation
you really think your dealer can afford to do that? There is likely a mess of labor to deal with this harness and you would expect your dealer to pay that for free, plus carry the floor-planning costs just because you are upset? You are being unreasonable. If you can use the lemon law to force the buyback, do that. then the costs land on the manufacture (you know, the ones that actually made the mistake), not your dealer. Kioti will also not deal well with you on your own. Get a lawyer and they will likely realize you are serious and do what they should do.
ps. problems getting parts to repair new vehicles is incredibly common everywhere. You'll absolutely deal with it with a new car, a side by side, and about every other complicated piece of machinery under the sun. It sucks, but it hardly unique to Kioti.
 

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I have zero experience with Kioti, but I know how big and small manufacturing companies work. You decided to purchase consumer grade from a multinational corporation selling stuff that was designed manufactured and delivered using as much cost savings as possible. There are downsides to that. There are companies that push the customer service side of things much harder (even large ones), but you have to pay for that. Parts and manufacturing run though entirely different logistics pathways for a company like Kioti. The service and the manufacturing harness may or may not even originate in the same factory. Even if they originate in the same factory, they are running through separate logistics tracks long before Kioti gets their hands on them. If you want to buy machinery from some place run like a mom and pop just around the corner, I suspect you had options (maybe Ventrac?) It is all about dollars and cents (that is why you went with them afterall). If you have a legal avenue, pursue it. If not, you are stuck waiting. This could have absolutely have happened with any of the tractors in this class of machinery and even several steps up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
What am I a missing here? I’m not asking the dealer to tear apart another new tractor in his showroom but I expect Kioti to take the next harness destined for a new assembly and instead of building a new tractor send me the friggin part. They can have their incomplete assembled tractor sit on the side waiting for a new harness. I called a few dealers discreetly and they all expect a continuous supply of new cx2510hst cabs over the next few months so Kioti has parts to assemble these models for new sales but not for warranty repair. That's bad business.
 

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What am I a missing here? I’m not asking the dealer to tear apart another new tractor in his showroom but I expect Kioti to take the next harness destined for a new assembly and instead of building a new tractor send me the friggin part. They can have their incomplete assembled tractor sit on the side waiting for a new harness. I called a few dealers discreetly and they all expect a continuous supply of new cx2510hst cabs over the next few months so Kioti has parts to assemble these models for new sales but not for warranty repair. That's bad business.
that is exactly what you asked for;
" If I see my dealer selling a new CX2510 HST CAB - without swapping out the bad harness first for me, I am going to be one very unhappy camper "
 

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That's what warranties are for, seems like your's is working.
I'm guessing your dealer ordered the harness as a Dealer Stock Order Request instead of an Emergency Order Request.
That is something you should have worked out with the dealer, it's not a manufacture issue.

On a side note my Kioti has been great with 750 hours on it.
 

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No they're not all in the same as far as parts availability. The John Deere 5065M here that has about 2100 hours on started dropping out of gear for no apparent reason. We changed the hydraulic filter and that didn't fix it. So we drove it to the JD dealer it came from. They ran a diagnostic on it and said it was the Clutch Pedal Position Sensor, basically a potentiometer, it threw an error code 8 times. The oldest mechanic there said they had never replaced one that he knew of and I was like oh boy this is going to be good. I asked how long it was take to get the part and he said 24 hours, I was shocked. They had it fixed within 48 hours as this is a full time operation of my son and wife so that was great. They've been spreading huge amount of manure off the feedlot this Winter and prefer to spread with that tractor.
 

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You are dealing with supply chain issues. Right now this is normal for every major manufacturer. I work in the Auto industry. It's just a fact of life. Wiring is one of the most difficult commodities to get.
I ordered a bunch of hydraulic lines for my John Deere 4720. The power beyond kit is in stock, but the 4/5 SCV kit is part of the great unknown.
Luckily I still have use of the tractor.
Patients is the name of the game these days. Supply chain shortages are everywhere.
 

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There is really no way to bypass the damaged wire(s)? I understand the hole/grommet leaves little clearance, but since the harness will be replaced, cut open the loom/wrapping and go back to a convenient place to make a splice. Strip the old wire out, feed the new wire through and temporarily wrap it with electrical tape and wire ties.

Ultimately, you might be better off using the Lemon Law. The tractor has been down for 4 weeks with no idea of when the harness might be shipped? If you can live w/o it, fine, but if you have a working farm, push for a loaner or replacement.
 

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No they're not all in the same as far as parts availability. The John Deere 5065M here that has about 2100 hours on started dropping out of gear for no apparent reason. We changed the hydraulic filter and that didn't fix it. So we drove it to the JD dealer it came from. They ran a diagnostic on it and said it was the Clutch Pedal Position Sensor, basically a potentiometer, it threw an error code 8 times. The oldest mechanic there said they had never replaced one that he knew of and I was like oh boy this is going to be good. I asked how long it was take to get the part and he said 24 hours, I was shocked. They had it fixed within 48 hours as this is a full time operation of my son and wife so that was great. They've been spreading huge amount of manure off the feedlot this Winter and prefer to spread with that tractor.
Deere is a long way from Kioti as far as historic parts availability (Deere is definitely starting to slip though), and a 5 series is several steps above a SCUT. a pedal is also likely common across several different machines where as a wiring harness is likely unique to on specific configuration of a specific machine.
 

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I work for an equipment manufacturer. More than half of my work these days is dealing with supply chain issues.
I wouldn't blame Kioti. You could have easily run into the same problem from any manufacturer.

Often parts and manufacturing uses different supply chains.

The tractors showing up were quite likely "in process" long before your dealer requested the harness.

About all you could do would be to try to get a buy-back and get another machine. I doubt your local lemon law will cover you tractor, but that might be worth looking into too.
I recently visited another manufacturer's facility and to deal with this very issue they started robbing parts off of new machines they had at their facility. Now they're stuck with a bunch of incomplete machines and don't have the manpower to put them back together, and they're probably going to have to sell for scrap. It's a huge cluster f and every manufacturer is dealing with the same thing. On the sub-100 hp tractors, the whole supply chain is overseas for all brands now. You're not avoiding this going with an American brand either AFAIK.
 

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There is really no way to bypass the damaged wire(s)? I understand the hole/grommet leaves little clearance, but since the harness will be replaced, cut open the loom/wrapping and go back to a convenient place to make a splice. Strip the old wire out, feed the new wire through and temporarily wrap it with electrical tape and wire ties.

Ultimately, you might be better off using the Lemon Law. The tractor has been down for 4 weeks with no idea of when the harness might be shipped? If you can live w/o it, fine, but if you have a working farm, push for a loaner or replacement.
this is a new machine under warranty. Mfgs also tend to not like to pay mechanics for this type of open ended electrical bs as it would be so incredibly easy to just lie outright when making a claim for reimbursement. This harness is also not easy to get to. How many times are you going to pull the cab about the same harness?

I agree with lemon-law if he can. I've got my doubts though. Lemon laws are generally very constrained. No idea what NY's says though.
 

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There is really no way to bypass the damaged wire(s)? I understand the hole/grommet leaves little clearance, but since the harness will be replaced, cut open the loom/wrapping and go back to a convenient place to make a splice. Strip the old wire out, feed the new wire through and temporarily wrap it with electrical tape and wire ties.
If this was my problem, I would also be looking at repairing the existing loom to get back in business while waiting for the replacement loom to show up. I have had some (but not complete) success finding matching replacement terminals to run the new wire complete to the connector block, very tidy. But my soldered butt-splices with heat-shrink cover have also turned out well, too. Any chance of borrowing the old loom for a day? Maybe the dealer would be happy to not have your tractor sitting in his shop for the duration.
 

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If this was my problem, I would also be looking at repairing the existing loom to get back in business while waiting for the replacement loom to show up. I have had some (but not complete) success finding matching replacement terminals to run the new wire complete to the connector block, very tidy. But my soldered butt-splices with heat-shrink cover have also turned out well, too. Any chance of borrowing the old loom for a day? Maybe the dealer would be happy to not have your tractor sitting in his shop for the duration.
several circuits are compromised to an unknown degree and this harness doesn't sound like it is overly easy to get to.
 

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several circuits are compromised to an unknown degree and this harness doesn't sound like it is overly easy to get to.
Sounds to me like the dealer does not want to play with the harness vis a vis a temporary repair like I and @Gopher Baroque suggested. No touch, no liability if something goes wrong, and he might have to send the old harness back to Kioti.

Let's not give Deere too much credit. I've been reading that their larger tractors now have electronic components that have to be "initialized" by a Deere tech with a Deere computer. The owner (farmer) cannot fix the tractor with aftermarket parts and needs to pay a Deere dealer to send someone out to get the tractor running again. In fact, prices, I've read, are going up for older mechanical tractors that can be fixed in the field with a bit of baling wire or generic nuts, bolts, and aftermarket parts.

We can expect this kind of thing to filter down to smaller tractors in the future.
 

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Sounds to me like the dealer does not want to play with the harness vis a vis a temporary repair like I and @Gopher Baroque suggested. No touch, no liability if something goes wrong, and he might have to send the old harness back to Kioti.

Let's not give Deere too much credit. I've been reading that their larger tractors now have electronic components that have to be "initialized" by a Deere tech with a Deere computer. The owner (farmer) cannot fix the tractor with aftermarket parts and needs to pay a Deere dealer to send someone out to get the tractor running again. In fact, prices, I've read, are going up for older mechanical tractors that can be fixed in the field with a bit of baling wire or generic nuts, bolts, and aftermarket parts.

We can expect this kind of thing to filter down to smaller tractors in the future.
The Deere DRM thing is definitely a huge deal to me. I find it to be a major example of Cooperate Greed run amok. The downsides for the end user drastically overwhelm the upsides (there are actually some). Getting these business practices under control is one of the few areas were I agree with more government intervention into our lives.
 
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