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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a 50s Ford 3500 industrial t/l/b which has been quite a project, and still is.
Here is the recent applicable history on my present issue which is the loader has no power, it won't pick the front of the tractor off the ground.

Last summer the tractor blew the transmission seal, when it turned over oil came out of the bell housing. Not having the shop/resources I transported the tractor to a shop. Before transporting I removed the hoe, no problem just messy.
Tractor was returned, actually I drove it home. At that time I noticed the right reservoir was leaking at a previous weld repair; and the steering cylinder was leaking.
Removed the reservoir and had it rewelded, removed the steering cylinder and that was gone through. Reinstalled everything and realized the tractor was not quite in line with the hoe so it had to be moved.
The right reservoir was empty. I used the starter to move the tractor back to where I could attach the hoses and then refill the hydraulic fluid. To get the tractor to move back I had to jack up the loader which was on the ground, I used a farm jack to get it just off the ground and then moved the tractor using the starter with the tractor in reverse.
Attached the hoe's hoses and got it back on the tractor. The hoe works well, stabilizers lift the rear end with no problem; bucket will also lift the tractor.
During the removal of the reservoir the hydraulic lines were not broken.
I realized the loader did not have the power it did have. It lifts all the way; the bucket hs full range but I'm not sure about how much power it has.
When I lower the bucket it will not lift the tractor, when it is on the ground and I move the bucket the bucket moves and the loader cylinders are pulled out - tractor will not lift.
I have checked the check valves and the relief valve, they are clean and seated. I have loosened both left and right hose fitting for the lift function and operated it to lift, small amounts of fluid did come out. When I had a fluid stream I tightened the connections again. The loader still will not lift the tractor.

I'm at a loss here. With the hoe working fine and the loader not I do not suspect fluid pressure. I haven't checked the pressure at the valve body or cylinders yet - I have to either borrow or purchase a gage.
Does anyone have any ideas on this? I would think an internal failure inside the valve body would cause this but hope that isn't the case here.
I don't believe there is air in the system, I haven't purged air except for what I described above. Is there a procedure to purge air from the valve body that I haven't seen? The controls have been run more than 20 times loader up/down and bucket in/out.

Any response will be appreciated.
 

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Is there diverter valve for the FEL? If so, I wonder if there is some debris restricting the port to the FEL?
 

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You can do a simple test to determine if you have a bad packing in one or more cylinders. Loader to the ground is the safest way. Fully extend or retract cylinder depending on setup then remove hoses on return side ( you can only do one cylinder at a time so you must cap all disconnected hoses that are not being tested) then put return side hose from cylinder into a clean bucket. Apply pressure to the cylinder and if oil comes out of return line it means the packing is bypassing so it will not build max pressure.
Repeat procedure for the other cylinder. The cylinders are hooked up together so you must isolate each cylinder.
Don't be shy to ask for clarification if I'm not clear enough on this.
Good luck
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Is there diverter valve for the FEL? If so, I wonder if there is some debris restricting the port to the FEL?
Pogpbill, thanks for the feeback, however. There is no diverter valve in the circuit. I have a two circuit Unit style valve, non-floating.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
You can do a simple test to determine if you have a bad packing in one or more cylinders. Loader to the ground is the safest way. Fully extend or retract cylinder depending on setup then remove hoses on return side ( you can only do one cylinder at a time so you must cap all disconnected hoses that are not being tested) then put return side hose from cylinder into a clean bucket. Apply pressure to the cylinder and if oil comes out of return line it means the packing is bypassing so it will not build max pressure.
Repeat procedure for the other cylinder. The cylinders are hooked up together so you must isolate each cylinder.
Don't be shy to ask for clarification if I'm not clear enough on this.
Good luck
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Dozer996, thanks for your input.
Yeah, I'm trying to picture what we are trying to accomplish here. Let's see: you want me to check for packing blow by.
So if I disconnect the bottom hose on a cylinder (the raise hose) and then apply fluid pressure in the opposite port (port that lowers loader) and fluid comes out the raise hose port it would show bad packing. Check both cylinders, one at a time; and then pull the top hose (lower loader port), apply pressure to raise the loader and check for fluid blow by again - again on both cylinders one at a time.
Does this sound right?
It is easier for me to disconnect the hoses at the cylinders and watch the cylinder ports. I can hold a bucket beneath each open port while testing. Might lose more fluid that way but the plumbing on this thing is hard to get to.
I would still expect the loader to move some doing this.
 

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You are close. You only need to test cylinder once. If packing is NFG it will leak both ways. So max the travel on the cylinder( down pressure) and then remove the up pressure hose from cylinder and put a cap on it so you do not loose oil from the other cylinder. Then put bucket under open port to catch enny oil that might come out. Apply down pressure and hold. If you get a steady stream of oil coming out of the open Port your packing is bypassing. Most of our old tractors bypass a bit. But if you get a steady stream then the pressure won't build . Repeat procedure for all cylinders.
 

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Here in Ontario Canada I can get a 2' HYD hose for about 20$ CA at princess auto. Then you can hold the hose in the bucket while your helper runs the hydraulic leavers. Remember gravity is your enemy and high pressure leaks can kill you.
BE CAREFUL.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks for the safety reminder.
The hydraulics on this little tractor are set up in parallel as you would expect for the loader. I disconnected the right side lift line (bucket on the ground) and let it bleed, then applied pressure to the fluid in the other hose (lower loader to raise the tractor front end) and I had a stream of fluid.
Yep, I have a lot of bypass! Besides three of my own that is.
I've removed the hoses and plugged them and the cylinders are waiting to be put on the pickup and taken to the person I have that works on them.
Now the starter won't stay engaged. Wimps out early before the tractor starts. Probably gonna hafta redo that too! When it rains it pours.
 
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