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Discussion Starter · #41 ·
I am going to move the tractor into my shop and pull the head there. I have a 2 foot precision straight edge so checking flatness is no problem. I just dont want to find a rust hole in a cylinder. Parts are ordered so the only thing holding progress up is me finding time to work at it. Will post pics.
 

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Discussion Starter · #42 ·
Hi guys, moved the tractor into the shop with the wife's assistance. first time ever on a tractor. The son usually helps with such things but he is away doing college work. I got home from work tonight and started to pull her down. pulled the hood and found the first surprise. the manifold had been broken and they cobbled stuff together so they could stick a muffler in the hole. second problem came when All of the exhaust manifold bolts came out but the long one in the middle. There wasn't enough of the stud and nut to even resemble a fastener. I ground it flush and still the manifold wouldn't come off of the stud. I took a cutoff wheel in the grinder and cut into the manifold about an inch from the head where the stud went through the manifold and cut the stud off. I will need a new manifold anyway. the rest of the tear down went with out a hitch. Pulled the head and all three cylinders look like they have seen water. the head gasket looks to me as there was blow by between all three cylinders. Parts are on the way and I think I will take a ball hone to the cylinders just to clean them up a bit. I could not feel a ridge on the top of the cylinders and there was very little side to side play between piston and cylinder. Maybe .003-.004 thousands. I do not see signs of liners.
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The head looks to have a lot of carbon build up. Here are some pics . what do you think?
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It's hard to tell from pictures but I do not see evidence of a failed head gasket. Could you use a pointer or mark them for me where you think they failed ?
I would drop the pan and pull the pistons. Then hone the bores. They might clean up. Measure them - since you say you have the tools and inspect for perforation/s.
These bores were not as nice. I was fortunate that they had been sleeved before and the sleeves came out with the pistons.
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Discussion Starter · #44 ·
I haven't had time to get back to the project but what I saw is the place marked in Red circle. There is carbon on the metal sealing ring on the gasket where there shouldn't be. on the pic below see where the red arrows are. compare it to where the green arrow is. There is a buildup of carbon where it should be clean. What do you think. enlarge the pic and look at the space between cyl #1 and 2. Or maybe It is not the place. When I pulled the head bolts the bolts in the rocker arm shaft were very loose. the outside ones were tight. Good suggestion Alphadog I think it wise to pull the pistons and hone the cylinders to clean and mike them. It will give me a chance to clean the pan out and check the lower end. what is the method you use to pull the injectors. Mine seem to be stuck in the bores. Any tips?
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What do you think.
 

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I haven't had time to get back to the project but what I saw is the place marked in Red circle. There is carbon on the metal sealing ring on the gasket where there shouldn't be. on the pic below see where the red arrows are. compare it to where the green arrow is. There is a buildup of carbon where it should be clean. What do you think. enlarge the pic and look at the space between cyl #1 and 2. Or maybe It is not the place. When I pulled the head bolts the bolts in the rocker arm shaft were very loose. the outside ones were tight. Good suggestion Alphadog I think it wise to pull the pistons and hone the cylinders to clean and mike them. It will give me a chance to clean the pan out and check the lower end. what is the method you use to pull the injectors. Mine seem to be stuck in the bores. Any tips? View attachment 60667 View attachment 60669 What do you think.
The arrows help. Yes, I see the discoloration now.
Still hard to say though - from here anyway. Loose head bolts is a good clue. Got my fingers crossed for luck for you.
I'm a carpenter so have a couple of cat's paw nail pullers and use a pair of those to pull the injectors - one on each side. Photo.
You can use a mechanic's pinch bars too.
Fyi, the nozzles (injector tips) protrude about 1/8" below the surface of the head. So don't set it upright on a hard surface or you'll damage them.
Also, you must slide the bolster (axle mount) forward about an inch to pull the pan on those.
I put the nose on mine this morning.
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Discussion Starter · #46 ·
In the middle of canning here this weekend. Corn peas and pickles, No time for my project. Cats paw sounds good. Your nose looks pristeen. Mine has been butchered and scabed back together. Wish we were closer as id be very interested in the nose you want to let go of. Ill look around here and see if i can dig one up. The guy who originally sold this tractor new is still in buisness but no longer a dealer. I will stop in and see if he might have one squireled away. You hve a real nice looking tractor Ultradog.
 

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Discussion Starter · #47 ·
One other thing is when the mrs. Helped get the tractor in the shop she said, and i quote "This thing needs to be painted". Now i dont know how you would take that statement, but i am taking it as permission to paint the tractor :)
 

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I drove mine today.
First time it's been out of the garage in 16 months.
I basically bought it for the tin - which was exceptional, and the platform and row crop stuff.
It was a gas, Select O Speed.
I put an 8 speed with IPTO transmission and rear end in it (same as yours) and converted the engine to diesel.
Has been a lot of tinkering.
I've owned a few of the AP 4000s but this is my first RC. There are a Lot of differences even though they're the same engine and chassis.
Here's what it looked like before.
I'll get some more photos of it when I get the rest of the tin on.
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Discussion Starter · #49 ·
I have had a chance to clean up some parts on the tractor this morning and got a better look at the head and block. This is the first time I have lifted the head on a ford 3 cyl. and not sure as what I am seeing. I will post a couple of pics and see what you think. One will show what I think to be sleeves though that is a guess. The other will show the head with a problem between cyl. 1 and 2. That is where I saw carbon on the head gasket on the sealing ring. The head will have to be milled to take this blemish out. The head itself is pretty flat .001-.002 feeler gauge in a couple places. The block is flat. except right at what I think is a liner you can catch your finger nail on the edge of the lip. I had a heck of a time pulling the injectors out of the head. They were rusted in. The top seal was very hard and must have let water in the bore of the injector. They are out and I believe by the looks of the tips I need to replace all 3 of them. I was able to pull the serial number off the tractor after a couple of minuets
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sanding with 120 grit paper. It is C446542 which makes this a 1974 Ap Diesel Independent with an 8 speed as was told to me earlier. The pic of the head is a bit blurry and does not show the depth of the blemish. It is about .007 deep at the worst spot. I will send it to the machine shop and have them vat the head check for cracks and mill the head till it cleans up. I have not pulled the valves out yet so as soon as I do I will see if it needs grinding. that will be very expensive here. If it does so be it. It is off and a good time to do it. Does anyone have a NAPA number for the ford blue paint? Well time to continue. Have a great day.
 

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Discussion Starter · #50 ·
By the looks of the intake valve in the pic above I am going to order all new valves and have the head ground and set up with new parts.
 

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I have had a chance to clean up some parts on the tractor this morning and got a better look at the head and block. This is the first time I have lifted the head on a ford 3 cyl. and not sure as what I am seeing. I will post a couple of pics and see what you think. One will show what I think to be sleeves though that is a guess. The other will show the head with a problem between cyl. 1 and 2. That is where I saw carbon on the head gasket on the sealing ring. The head will have to be milled to take this blemish out. The head itself is pretty flat .001-.002 feeler gauge in a couple places. The block is flat. except right at what I think is a liner you can catch your finger nail on the edge of the lip. I had a heck of a time pulling the injectors out of the head. They were rusted in. The top seal was very hard and must have let water in the bore of the injector. They are out and I believe by the looks of the tips I need to replace all 3 of them. I was able to pull the serial number off the tractor after a couple of minuets View attachment 60937 View attachment 60939 View attachment 60941 sanding with 120 grit paper. It is C446542 which makes this a 1974 Ap Diesel Independent with an 8 speed as was told to me earlier. The pic of the head is a bit blurry and does not show the depth of the blemish. It is about .007 deep at the worst spot. I will send it to the machine shop and have them vat the head check for cracks and mill the head till it cleans up. I have not pulled the valves out yet so as soon as I do I will see if it needs grinding. that will be very expensive here. If it does so be it. It is off and a good time to do it. Does anyone have a NAPA number for the ford blue paint? Well time to continue. Have a great day.
Pictures are kind of tantalizing. You can see but not touch and feel.
Those rings around the bores do look like sleeves to me. Can you catch them with a fingernail?
If it was sleeved it would pretty much rule out a cavitation problem and indicate a problem with the deck, head or gasket.
I would suggest you have your machine shop make the decision whether you need new valves, springs, etc and not just arbitrarily buy them. Those parts are not that expensive but no sense buying what you don't need.
 

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BTW,
I have never bought tractor paint from Napa so cant say if they have it or not. They will likely sell a Ford Blue but it will be an automotive blue (ford engines in cars/trucks) and not the Empire Blue used from 1962-99 on Ag stuff.
Are your plans to give it a rattle can job? My experience with those is they fade rather quickly and just do not last. If you have spray equipment then for sure buying the paint in quarts is the way to go. Always use a hardener if you spray.
Another option if you don't have spray equipment is a brush job.
This is the bolster on my 4200 (4000 RC)
I have a little corner "office" in my garage which I can heat.
What you see is two coats with a good "china bristle" brush that I did last winter. I used Tisco paint straight out of the can.
I'm betting you have access to Tisco products up there?
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Discussion Starter · #53 ·
That looks good Ultradog. I will have to check and see if we have that. I do have spray equipment so I think I will go that route.
just a bit of an update. The head is in the machine shop as this is being written. Per there recommendation I will need to replace all 3 Exhaust valves and all 6 springs. They said that the intakes would clean up fine and would be better than aftermarket. The Ford/New Holland garage has got hold of an oem gasket set and head gasket. it is in and I tried to pick it up this morning but he must sleep in as he was not open at 10 A.M. I drained the tranny and the rear end and the tranny had water in it. I am trying to flush the case and put some heat on the casing to dry the internals out before i install new oil. The rear looked clean with no shiny bits in the oil. The leveling device on the 3 point hitch is frozen in place and am soaking it in penetrating oil. looks to be the little bevel gear to be stuck. Tryed to pull the top pin so I could get at it but the pin is stuck in the knuckle of the leveler. I could not find my 2 jaw puller to try to push it out so a search is underway. Will have pics of the parts before I reassemble. Good day to all and God Bless.
 

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Discussion Starter · #54 ·
Hi Guys, sorry for being away for so long. It took the machine shop a lot longer than I hoped it would. They milled the head, installed 3 new intake valves, all new springs and valve seals. She looks like a new one. I got excited about getting the head I installed it before I took pics of it. I got a factory head gasket and gasket kit so it is starting back together. About a week ago I put about 2 gal. of diesel in the crank case and installed a new filter I spun it with the starter and forced clean diesel through the oil system. I was a bit skeptacle but the ford mechanic said they did it when they got one with water in the oil. I drained it out and boy what a pile of stuff came out of the crank case. now he then said to put 2 quarts of oil in the pan and spin it again and the oil will force the diesel out of the system. Then you drain that out. It looked pretty clean. now to continue the reassembly. I will try to get photos tomorrow.
 

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My 4000 has 13.6x38 rears and a mixed bag on the front. If a rear is leaking calcium, it needs immediate attention to keep from loosing the rim. I have not seen an older tractor that did not have tubes. If a tube is leaking, you need to find the cause before installing a new tube. Check the inside of the tire for thorns or nail or screw and put on an internal patch before installing a new tube. Also, coat the new tube with talcum powder applied with a brush. It will prevent the tube from pinching while inflating which can produce a hole in the tube. E-Bay has an excellent bead breaker fot tractor tires fo $65, tgat will save a lot of time and effort.
 
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Discussion Starter · #56 ·
Thanks for the advice Ed. My plan is to install new rims and tires as the rims are very rusty and the tires are all but worn out. my plan is to not fill the tires but to use dry weights on the wheels. That way if and when I have a tire issue I don't have to mess with the loaded tires. mine are loaded with calcium and it looks like they have been leaking a long time. Like I said the rims are very rusty. I have not had enough time to take pics of the progress as there has been no progress. With winter approaching there is a lot to do to get ready. When things get done I will get back to working on the ford. I have been looking for a cab for the old girl as she will be used as a snow blower in the winter. would be nice to have a heater
 

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Discussion Starter · #57 ·
Hi All, I have reassembled the motor with the reconditioned head and new gaskets. I filled the coolant with HD coolant and let it set for a week. I wanted to see if any coolant leaked into the pan before I added oil. At the end of the week I pulled the plug and all that came out was a bit of old oil. just a few drops. I thought I was good to go so I filled the crankcase with fresh oil and installed a new filter. I left the valve cover off so I could see when the oil had reached the rockers. I left the fuel valve off as I did not want it to start. I cranked it over with the starter to pre fill the oil system with oil before trying to start it for the first time. As I spun it over I started to get oil through the valve train along with antifreeze. I had purged the oil system with diesel so this antifreeze is not from the old problem of blown head gasket. It confused me how there could be no water in the pan but I am getting oil out the rockers. It looks like I will have to pull the engine out and rebuild the whole thing. I had the pan off and saw no signs of water coming through by the sleeves. I just hope that the machine shop did not miss a crack from the water jacket to the oil galleys. It does not bother me that I have to build the whole engine, new sleeves, pistons, rings, bearings both rod and main, cam bearings. you get the idea go through the whole engine. It will be better than new after. It will also give me the opportunity to check the condition of the clutch and pressure plate . Of course new seals everywhere. From what I found out about the tractor they overheated it several times. it had no water temp gage or oil light so God knows what I will find. All of this will have to wait till spring as old man winter is taking over and I want to park my truck in the garage, I hate scraping my windshield. The best part is I can order parts and have everything ready for when I take at it in the spring. Wish me luck. I will let you guys know. Oh and a shout out to Ultradog. He has gone the extra mile Thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #58 ·
I felt that a name change was in order. more to the true nature of the beast. The tractor is packed away for the winter. I am making lists of parts needed in the spring when I pull the motot and do a full out of frame rebuild. Trying to do a patch job is not in my nature but I wanted to find out the nature of the tractor. How did it run, oil pressure clutch condition, all sorts of things that you can only tell when the engine is running. I tried to patch it with a top end and see if it was runnable or if it did need to be totally gone through. When I saw water being pumped through the system I just stopped trying to get it to run and decided to wait till spring and do it properly. all for the best.
 

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Discussion Starter · #59 ·
Hi Guys, Well old man winter has finally decided to let spring poke its head out so I will be pushing the Tractor into the shop and start the tear down. I will give you guys plenty of pics so you can help me through the process. I checked the oil in the tractor and as expected it is over full and I expect to see water in the base again. will let you know.
 

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Discussion Starter · #60 ·
Well after 4 days of rain wont be moving the tractor for a few more days. It got the ground so soft I dont dare to hitch onto it and pull it to the shop. Will let you guys know when I get it to the shop.
 
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