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bigdaddygb · 08-15-2011, 11:41 AM

Ok so i purchased property about 5 months ago and found an old foundation on the property ( still in great condition) where they must have had a shed or a small barn at one time. It's about 12' x 12' and looks like they used 2x 10 or 12" boards as runners. Anyways, I plan to rebuild the shed and use it for a cabin of sorts till my house is complete to stay overnight in a few weekends a month. My question is this:
with the space being 12x12 and it being built as a lean-to style shed.. 3 walls are 8ft tall and 1 wall is 10' tall assuming there is r13 in walls what wold you recommend for a heat source? Wood is doable but might not be efficient enough to burn all night without being too big for shed. Gas ( not so sure I'd trust it in such a small space) and there is no electric to shed yet, as my property will be totally green and run off of solar, and wind electric generators with city back up.

Let me know your ideas.

Thanks,
BigdaddyGB

**tractor beam** · 08-15-2011, 12:53 PM

All depends on the budget....... First off, I'm not sure how cold it gets but if it gets to freezing and beyond, then I would go with R19 in the walls or even shoot I believe it's spelled Icinine insulation which retains heat so much better than fiberglass. I'd go with at least an R38 in the lid and would even consider R60 if it got super cold. With no power in the rough, I'd go with some form of gas heat. A wood stove would have such a big footprint, unless you did a zero clearance canted off the floor joists so that it didn't take up any of you floor space.

Thomas · 08-15-2011, 04:23 PM

What season do you plan staying in shed?

If enough wood from house clearing site small wood stove.

**jhngardner367** · 08-15-2011, 06:23 PM

Go to a salvage yard that scraps out rv's,campers,etc,and buy a propane powered furnace.The blowers are 12vdc powered,and the use a thermostat to set the heat level.The later models are prefered,as they have the enclosed furnace burners,rather than the upright box type found in older ones.These furnaces don't need chimneys,as the outlet/intake mounts flush to the wall,or in a window.Mine puts out 36000btu,and heats a 24x48 garage nicely,at -22deg.f.

Halifax · 08-15-2011, 07:00 PM

I have a small shed/cabin 12X14 with very little insulation. Only have 4" in the roof. I've kept it toasty (+70F) using a small LP vent less heater on a 20lb tank. I think its about 13000 btu on high, but mostly use it on the lower settings. We've managed to stay comfortable down to 0 degrees over the winters about 4 years now. Granted I only go there on the weekends. The tank last 2 weekends @ 18 bucks to refill. If I had it to do over again, I would build the shed like a standard building vice, using wood from an 100 year house. I have it built on 2X10s, 7 feet in the back and 9 feet in the front. Not the prettiest thing, but it beats a tent...
Aubrey

bigdaddygb · 08-15-2011, 09:49 PM

ok.. my budget lets say $250 possibly more just depends on how fast winter comes this year.. as for gas... I like the vent less idea but we apparently have a bunch of kids that like to mess with stuff in the neighborhood and I'm afraid they'll set it on fire or steal it.. I plan to stay in it almost every weekend depending on weather.
I have seen homemade wood stoves using old propane tanks and such that seem to work pretty well and i thought about the wood barrel stoves but again they take up too much room. My shed is about 100-120 feet from where I'd park so I'd have to haul the tanks back there some how which is not a big concern but someone stealing them is.
The winters well we usually have snow and temps get down into the teens and sometimes single digits. stays that way for about 3 possibly 4 months every year. The past few years we have had big snow storms or 2-3ft of snow in one day. Although I'd stay plenty warm working on the farm in my Carhart insulated suit I'd like some place warm to sleep at night be fore going back home the next day.
Nice shed/cabin halifax.

Mickey · 08-16-2011, 10:21 AM

As has been suggested, I'd go for construction that permitted more insulation than you've stated. The better insulated, the less heat you need to keep things cozy.

Think Halifax's suggestion for using an RV heater is a great idea. They are small, fully enclosed and all air/gases are outside air. The only down side is they take ~7-8A to run the fan. Depending upon duty cycle, on long cold nights 1 battery may not be enough and would need to recharged the next day. Also, LA batteries shouldn't be discharged more than ~50% for good cycle life. Small 20# portable tanks easy to handle and can be brought inside over the week while away. Should be cheap to pick up a used one.

stickerpicker · 08-16-2011, 11:48 AM

If you are going solar there isn't a better time to begin than now. Start by building the shed/cabin passive solar and possibly one solar panel if that's in the budget.

Halifax · 08-16-2011, 12:35 PM

Bigdaddy,
This is what I'm using,

90 bucks at Northern should heat up to 700 sq feet. Vent free, but I have a CO2 monitor inside just because I'm paranoid. I took it back and forth for a couple of years until I got lazy and just left it inside.

Aubrey

**tractor beam** · 08-16-2011, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halifax

Bigdaddy,
This is what I'm using,

90 bucks at Northern should heat up to 700 sq feet. Vent free, but I have a CO2 monitor inside just because I'm paranoid. I took it back and forth for a couple of years until I got lazy and just left it inside.

Aubrey

This is what I'm talking about!

Halifax · 08-16-2011, 06:10 PM

I dont neeed any power for the heater. I do have a separate 100 watt solar - 12v generator to run fans, direct tv, window ac. (OK i know its not roughing it, but i have to watch the football games, and i need to sleep in cool air. Have 10 gal solar shower for summer.

But back to your project, insulate as much as you can, i didnt and can tell in the winter. 20 degree nights in winter its 80 degrees at head level and 50 at the feet!
Aubrey

bigdaddygb · 08-16-2011, 06:19 PM

nice.. I will be checking that out... and yes I already have plans for my solar wind project.. see below

Bryan1 · 08-18-2011, 01:43 AM

I'd advise against putting ANY wind generators attached to the container as they will vibrate the crap out of the said container. Also for a wind genny to get decent wind they should be 30' or more above any obstruction and 200' or more clear of trees etc. What I'll be doing on this new 40x20' foot shed I'm building is putting 1/2" poly pipe in the concrete and the wood stove we have here does need a total steel refit so while I'm doing that I'll put some copper pipe in the back for heating water. The water will run thru the pipe in the concrete and heat the floor.

As for solar hot water one can't go past using a solar batch heater for a smaller footprint but plenty of hot water too. Basically a batch heater is just a old mains hot water tank with the insulation ripped off and put inside a box with reflective sides and point the box towards the sun. It does pay to put a blind for night time so the heat can stay in the vessel. I do have an old gas hot water tank here which has an open pipe going thru the centre of the tank. Now by putting some resistive elements inside that centre tube one could design and make a wind genny to heat the elements so if the sun isn't shining but the wind is blowing one can still have hot water.

Now another good advantage of in floor pipes is in summer during long hot spells one can pump cold water thru the pipes to cool the concrete slab. About 50' away from my new shed is 200' 3" bore hole and I'll dig a trench to it and put in some pipe so it goes all the way to the bottom of the hole and a return pipe. Now when it's 45 C in the shade here in summer by pumping the cool water thru the slab it will cool the shed too.

Cheers Bryan

bigdaddygb · 08-18-2011, 06:23 AM

I have nothing blocking me on three sides of my box's future location. I do appreciate the info on not mounting it to the box. I had planned to put them in the ground but just have them directly behind the box, but since I thought it'd be easier to just mount them against the box that's how I drew it. But again thanks for the info. I'll go back to my original thought and mount them in the dirt behind my box. I had planned to use a batch water heater but my end up using a active flat panel type instead. I like the thought of using the hot and cold water in the tubes for the floor but again this will eventually be a shed nothing more... for now a little hideaway in the woods. lol

jamiebell · 08-21-2011, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halifax

I have a small shed/cabin 12X14 with very little insulation. Only have 4" in the roof. I've kept it toasty (+70F) using a small LP vent less heater on a 20lb tank. I think its about 13000 btu on high, but mostly use it on the lower settings. We've managed to stay comfortable down to 0 degrees over the winters about 4 years now. Granted I only go there on the weekends. The tank last 2 weekends @ 18 bucks to refill. If I had it to do over again, I would build the shed like a standard building vice, using wood from an 100 year house. I have it built on 2X10s, 7 feet in the back and 9 feet in the front. Not the prettiest thing, but it beats a tent...
Aubrey

Can you mention the heater brand for us?

Halifax · 08-21-2011, 05:55 PM

I'm trying to remember how much I paid for it, its been a couple of years. I don't like the ones with the ceramic piece inside. Here's one that is similar to what I have (10,000 btu). I've seen them up to 30,000 btu, but they are more for a large garage. ProCom Vent-Free Propane Ice House Heater —*10,000 BTU, 300 Sq. Ft. Heating Area | Propane Heaters | Northern Tool + Equipment

Specs:
Category Type Convection heat
Product Style Stationary / ice house
Vent-Free Yes
Heating Capability (sq. ft.) 300
Heat Settings Variable
BTU Output 10,000
Clearance from Corner (in.) 6
Clearance from Rear Wall (in.) 6
Clearance from Side Wall (in.) 6
Thermostat Included Yes
Blower Included No
Igniter Piezo
Oxygen Depletion Sensor Yes

I made a small stand to mount the heater on the front and the 20lb cylinder on the back.

Aubrey

Cublover · 09-10-2011, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mickey

As has been suggested, I'd go for construction that permitted more insulation than you've stated. The better insulated, the less heat you need to keep things cozy.

Think Halifax's suggestion for using an RV heater is a great idea. They are small, fully enclosed and all air/gases are outside air. The only down side is they take ~7-8A to run the fan. Depending upon duty cycle, on long cold nights 1 battery may not be enough and would need to recharged the next day. Also, LA batteries shouldn't be discharged more than ~50% for good cycle life. Small 20# portable tanks easy to handle and can be brought inside over the week while away. Should be cheap to pick up a used one.

I would insulate that puppy till I could heat it with a candle and cool it with an ice cube! I can keep 28X15 at 68 degrees for $18. per week. If you can't get double paned wimdows, get windows of the same size and 'caulk' them together.
A guy has to do what a guy has to do!
I have been buying the argon filled double paned windows as the budjet dictates for 6 years now. So far, I've bought 25 of them. Most of your heat loss will be through windows and doors if the walls and celing are sealed tight and have insulation.

Cublover · 09-10-2011, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tractor beam

This is what I'm talking about!

Blue flame? I have one of the Catylist units. I LOVE it! (but Tractor Supply quit selling the one I like last year)
The blue flame unit seems to 'smell' more and use more gas. I tried it, took it back and bought a wood stove instead.

Cublover · 09-10-2011, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tractor beam

This is what I'm talking about!

$189. tractor Supply or Southern States.
I have a 'blue flame 10,000 btu that I would sell for $75. (had 2 20# tanks ran through it.)
I paid $169. for it, but we never developed a relationship.

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