gravning

My relatively new (18 months and 180 hours) Jinma broke in half while I was using the front end loader (Jinma factory loader). For those familiar with the 284 it split clean through about 6 inches ahead of creeper gear. Had it not been for the frame mounted backhoe being attached (that tied the front and back halves together) the tractor might have actually collapsed in two pieces - possibly with me somewhere between the wreckage!

I have called the dealer - Keno Tractors - but the one year warranty is up and he's not willing to do anything but sell me the parts at his cost (plus shipping). I'm not even sure how many parts I need to replace yet.

The tractor is now totally useless and has been sitting in my driveway - right where it broke - for a week. I'm not even sure how to move it or get it on a trailer without doing more damage.

Suggestions?

Live Oak

Welcome to Tractor Forum gravning. Very sorry to hear about your mishap. You might try borrowing or buying a set of 4 of the auto dolly wheels to place under each of the tires. If the tractor is in your driveway and the pavement fairly smooth, this may allow you to manuever the tractor to a suitable location in your garage.

Have you had your dealer come and look at the tractor? Perhaps he may be able to point out something that may have contributed to the failure.

Hopefully Chip Uren will see this post and add his comment and suggestions.

al b

Another broken tractor? I didn't know they broke so often. Sorry to hear it. Can you post pictures so we can get a better ides of what happened?

gravning

I tried attaching a photo with the original post - it didn't go through for some reason. I will try again - or post a link to another site

Attached Images

 

chrpmaster

All I can say is WOW! (Actually I can think of other comments but want to keep it clean)

This happens and the dealer is no help? With this much damage clearly you are looking at a major repair bill. Unless you are going to do it yourself I would have whoever will do the work figure out the transport. That way if anything else gets messed up they did it to themselves.

Do you have any idea how much this would cost to fix? I am wondering if it is worth fixing.

Are you a member over on chinese tractor owners association (ctoa.net)? I looked on there site and Keno tractor is an advertiser. It could light a fire under them to take better care of you if you post this over there. Also the members are more knowledgable about your tractor.

Let us know what you end up doing with this.

Andy

__________________
Stupidity is exasperating. Willful ignorance is bulletproof.

Having government manage your health care is like having Michael Vick watch your dog.

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Live Oak

She is broke in half hard. There are a number of things that can cause or contribute to this in addition to a casting flaw. Mounting a back hoe that does not have a suitable sub frame is one of them. No way to tell if this may have contributed or not.

At this point the issue is, how do we get your tractor repaired and back into operation. Have you asked the dealer if he would split the labor cost with you in addition to the parts at his cost? That is probably the best deal you are likely to get unless you can do the labor yourself. Removing the FEL and back hoe would be a big labor saver if you can do that and let the dealer do the rest.

This bit of advice I realize is after the horse has left the barn but none the less valuable. In most if NOT nearly ALL cases, most tractors are NOT designed for use with an add on back hoe. Yes, for very limited moderate to light use, they will work but for anything else, a full on factory designed back hoe is the tool needed. They are designed a with many areas structurally enhanced and beefed up in order to stand up to repeated use. They also have a heavy duty complimentary sub frame that joins the back hoe to the frame of the tractor reinforcing to make it even stronger since a back hoe can place extreme stress on the tractor bell housing with this subframe. The manauls for these back hoes also stress regular and periodic inspection and torquing the bolts and pins securing the sub frame.

I am definitely not telling you this to rub salt in your financial wounds...........but to make you aware of this after you have repair your tractor. Chances are that you may break the tractor in half again under the same conditions of useage.

You might also want to take the broken halfs of the bell housing to a welding shop for evaluation. I doubt it, but they may be able to repair the broken halves by welding and reinforcing them. In the event this is possible, you would only be our your time, labor, and cost of welding/reinforcement repairs.

Anyhow, just wanted to throw a few ideas and thoughts out there.

Chip (he goes by the username ARTRAC) may have some better ideas. Try emailing or calling him:

http://www.artrac.com/default.asp

He drops in from time to time, tell him we sure miss his presence around here lately!

gravning

If having a frame mounted backhoe mounted is a known problem why would the dealer even sell me that setup? He should have warned me about it. The FEL is a Jinma product, the backhoe is a chinese aftermarket as far as I can tell. I am really frustrated with this tractor, I am regretting buying a chinese tractor at this point.

gravning

I have made contact with the factory in China. I'm hoping they step up and do the right thing. If they could provide the parts and authorize one of their dealers to provide the labor to put the thing back together I would feel a lot better about Jinma tractors.

My problem is that I just don't have the tools nor the time to tackle this thing myself. I am running a business and building a house and my hands are pretty full right now - in fact I was filling in the utility trench when the tractor broke.

Now I am going to have either rent a machine or have someone else come in and finish the job.

SHARTEL

Hey gravning, Welcome to TF and I’m very sorry to hear of your misfortune with the Jinma.

It is fortunate that you weren’t hurt during the failure and that is the only plus I can think of in your situation.

The occurrences of these tractors, and their metallurgical failures is more frequent than people realize. I have often read of poor castings where front axles, spindles and bell housings have failed, leaving the owner with costly repairs, little or no help (once the warranty has ended) and the costs envolved with fixing are higher than the residual value of the tractor itself.

I do NOT want to discourage you but see only two possible avenues on how to proceed. IMO, I would contact a ‘District or Area Manager’ and politely, but firmly report the incident, include all the particulars like hours, maintenance schedule, attachments sold and in use, and include pictures of the failure. Then ask this person on how or IF he will help. Also mention that you are a member of a tractor forum and would like to report either; How cooperative, helpful and a gentleman who stands behind his product is….OR - how uncooperative, abandoned and how terrible Jinma is with handling an unpredictable catastrophic failure due to no fault of the owner/operator, but the design flaw engineered by the company.

If you seek legal counsel from an attorney, I don’t think you have any recourse with the tractor no longer covered under warranty (I’m not positive though). I would most certainly check your homeowners insurance policy, talk with your agent, and you may be surprised to find that your equipment is covered!

I truly hope this isn’t a lose-lose situation and you’re faced with parting out and selling whats salvageable, then starting over with another brand of tractor. Good luck, please keep us informed and I (we) hope for positive results.

SHARTEL

Ranch Hand

I could not agree more.....


Hi everyone !.

gravning,
Really sorry about youre tractor. I have seen a few tractors broke in the bell housing area over time on different makes/brands of tractors and it seems they all were involved with a loader, backhoe or both at one time or the other.

We are a repair shop that started importing Jinma tractors in 2004. We seen right off that (in our opinion) that these tractors really NEED a good prep before putting to work..... and I am not saying yours was not.

Did you buy a crate tractor?

Assuming a little here ????. But going by the picture and what you said, It looks like you have a Jinma 254 / 284, 200 series and with a ZL20 loader ?.

The ZL20 does not have axle braces ..... between the bell housing loader brackets and the rear axle. It can be added.
If you were doing some hard hitting loader work ???.... that will / would bust it.

Based on all the emails I get / have got for parts & repair work etc.....that it is not a very common break / problem.

I don't know where you are located. ???

Without standing in front of your tractor and if it were in my shop, I see 3 ways to fix / repair it.

I could weld it with no warranty..... have had pretty good luck with cast. But still no warranty. I would also have to inspect to see if the pto input shaft got bent etc.

Get another housing and swap over all the gears and needed parts.

Get another housing with the gears in it.

The sad part is neither one is a cheap fix.

I will be glad to help you if I can?

Maybe someone else will chim in with some other options.


Ronald
Ranch Hand Supply
Chesapeake VA.

chrpmaster

Welcome to the Tractor Forum Ranch Hand!

Good suggestions on fixing the problem. It always good to hear from a professional familiar with these tractors.

Andy

__________________
Stupidity is exasperating. Willful ignorance is bulletproof.

Having government manage your health care is like having Michael Vick watch your dog.

Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting to see what they will have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the outcome of the vote.

gravning

Thank you for your response, Yes the loader is the zl20 - but no it was not a crate tractor. I bought it with the backhoe attached as a package frome Keno tractor in Keno Oregon.

I realized early on that this was not an industrial strength tractor. When I had about 5 hours on it I hit a pile of dirt with the front end loader- like I would with a Kubota or a Johne Deere and the torque sent the retaining ring and pin flying - and the upper arm of the loader coming directly at my chest. Since that time I only scoop dirt in the low range at an extremely low speed - as I was doing when the tractor had the failure. I treat it as a farm tractor not an industrial tractor.
Isn't it up to the dealer to properly prepare these tractors? I was very clear about my needs for the tractor before I bought it - and I spent over $21,000 with Keno between the tractor and implements. If the tractors are not capable of handling the task of moving dirt with both a loader and backhoe attached - fine - but Keno or Jinma should have advised me of that up front.

I am attaching a photo of exactly what I was doing at the time - the tractor still sits where it broke while I try to figure out how to move it without causing additional damage.

Again - thanks for the response - and I am located in the far northwest near Bellingham WA

Attached Images

 

Ranch Hand

Just for the record ..... I am not trying to defend KENO, Jinma, you or promote Ranch Hand Supply. Just posting my opinion to help give you something to think about.



#1. I don't really understand what broke but, that could have weaken the bellhousing when that happen ?

#2. Most would think so but, does not mean they did. And some would agree that all dealers don't.... no matter what brand of tractor.

#3. There are thousands of the 200 series Jinma's doing so. I have one that I use on my small horse farm.

#4. That is a tough one !!

#5. No problem. I don't think we could get any futher apart without getting our feet wet ....lol.


There are so many possibilities that can cause tractors to break like that or similer to yours??

You are welcome to send me several pictures ( a lot ) at different angles of all the backhoe / loader contact points. Not real close. Don't edit them. Leave the picture big so I can edit them myself.

You can use any of the email address from my web site: www.ranchhandsupply.com

We Dealers that import directly from the Jinma factory only get a one year, parts only warranty.


Ronald
Ranch Hand Supply

Live Oak

Hey! Welcome to Tractor Forum Ranch Hand! Glad to see you posting.

OneWelder

quite often you can see a casting flaw- study the grain,also look for a place that is a lot thinner

MFreund

I would like to see how this is handled by the factory. That will tell volumes how they will do future business.

Welcome Ranch Hand, Thanks for a dealer perspective.

On a different note, My wife's car broke the coil spring last week and I was talking to the mechanic and he said the iron coming from China lately(last 10 yrs) is such poor quality things like coils springs that used to last the life of the car now last 8-10 years. He also stated that his place won't resurface brake rotors because the rotors have hard and soft spots in them. They just replace them. Connected??

Ranch Hand

Thanks for the welcome guys !!

Ronald
Ranch Hand Supply

Simpleprestige

Go to a bookstore and buy the book:

The coming China Wars, by Peter Navarro.


I saw him speak last year and have my copy sitting next to me. It really outlines how chinese manufacturers are devastating Americans with their unfair bussiness practices, cheap labor, illegal activities, and most importantly.. INFERIOR PRODUCTS.

To be honest with you I would almost completely blame the downfall of GM, Chrysler and Ford on how they buy most of their products from China, resulting in reliablility issues that have driven many people to switch to Toyota, Honda, or VW.

I know I am way off topic here, but I just thought I'd provide a little insight on my absolute hate for Chinese products.

Good luck with your tractor and I hope it works out for you.. BTW, that loader frame looks really flimsy!?!?!

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Ranch Hand

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Ronald
Ranch Hand Supply

Simpleprestige

Yeah I am quite upset with Deere for tainting themselves with this, but I can't do anything about it, and I have yet to see ANYTHING without an affiliation with China. It's depressing

__________________
John Deere 3520
-300x loader w/ heavy duty Bucket
-iMatch
-Frontier 72" blade
-616 Rotary Cutter
-30+ yr. old 2 bottom plow
1992 Chevy Silverado
Simplicity Prestige
Yamaha Grizzly